Degraded Hamas horrifically but destroying its military capability, ideology real challenge: Top Israeli intelligence expert

New Delhi: Colonel (Retd.) Miri Eisin, a veteran of Israeli intelligence with a distinguished career spanning two decades, has served in critical intelligence roles within the military to advising the country’s Prime Minister during pivotal moments. Colonel Eisin brings an unparalleled depth of knowledge regarding Middle East and Counter-terrorism.

Currently a Fellow at the International Institute for Counter-Terrorism, a faculty at Reichman University, and a leading voice in global media on Middle Eastern affair, Colonel Eisin spoke with IANS in this exclusive interview on the events following October 7, 2023 in context of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, offering her comprehensive and nuanced perspective.

Excerpts:

IANS. What is the anatomy of Hamas attack on Israel that took place on October 7, 2023? How it is different, from the earlier attacks?

Miri Eisin: When we talk about the Hamas terror attack on October 7, 2023, we’re talking about something that Hamas prepared for a very long time, and I’m going to divide it into two different aspects — the attack itself on October 7, meaning the infiltration into Israel, and that Hamas prepared for such a long time is what I’m going to call tiers of defence, levels of defence that were prepared physically, underground, above ground, years in advance to support the attack itself into Israeli territory. The terror attack into Israel was a unique one. We don’t want any other terror organizations copying this modus operandi. But, the aspect of what they prepared in their tiers of defence is really where Israel, for the last year and four months, is finding the biggest challenges, because beyond that horrific terror attack of October 7, what they built inside the Gaza Strip as their defence system is an enormous underground sub terrain, an arena which is only for the use of Hamas, the terror army. This is something which is incredibly difficult for militaries to do anything with. And that’s what Israel has been trying to destroy for over a year and four months. And you do it systematically, slowly. But there’s no easy way to do so. It’s built underneath the entire Gaza Strip, hundreds of kilometres of underground subterranean tunnels that interconnect, that are protected. That’s where they put the hostages that they took. It’s where they have their own defences. They want to pull the Israeli Defence Forces (IDF) under underground. What it gives the terror army is the protection underground, and mobility. Mobility is a very military term. In the second level of defence, Hamas built an advanced underground subterranean arena they were building for two dozen years. This is something that they’ve been doing for such a long time. Above ground, it’s taking the urban area. Think of the urban sprawl, a city sprawl anywhere in the world, in India or anywhere you’re thinking of, and in the structures themselves, in the buildings where people live, that’s where you are building all of the different positions. Assuming that the IDF are going to come in, you come into urban area, which is always a difficult military arena, and Hamas built into the children’s room on the second floor and the third apartment; behind underneath their beds, they were having the RPG positions. Hamas also built the different structures and positions for the missiles, the rockets, the different type of projectiles that they have in the mosque, in the courtyard of the school, inside the classroom, let alone inside and underneath hospitals. And these are things where we say the term ‘terror army’. No army does that. A ‘terror army’ does that. So you have things that were prepared years in advance, underground and above ground. But those are only two layers of defence that Hamas prepared in advance. They also took the hostages.

IANS: So was taking hostages also a part of this multi-tier strategy of Hamas?

Miri Eisin: Well, one of the main focus of the October 7 attack, when they came in from over 60 different sites simultaneously, where they overcame all of the different defences that we had and didn’t have, they were coming in to murder, to terrorize, to brutalize by barbaric attacks in every way. I don’t like expanding on it. It hurts me to even talk about it. But the focus was in coming in there, taking 250 different hostages from the age of nine months, where they brutally murdered a nine-month baby that they took alive and then murdered with bare hands afterwards. They killed people from some nine months to the age of 84, from different communities.

IANS: Why was Hamas focused on taking Israeli citizens as hostages?

Miri Eisin: The hostage taking is to terrorize, to scare us, to tear us apart as Israelis. That is their defence system; that they’re tearing us apart, and also this hostage taking was to be used in a horrific way as a bargaining chip. So you already have here three tiers of defence that Hamas built over years. And the hostage situation was the target.

IANS: You mentioned about three levels of ‘defence’ built by Hamas, what were the other two levels?

Miri Eisin: Two additional levels of defence were built upfront by Hamas for over a very long time period. One is the international organisations, the UNRWA. The main employer inside the Gaza Strip, after the Hamas controlled government was the United Nations Organization agency called UNRWA. A lot of people have heard of it. The United Nations Relief and Welfare Agency for the Palestinian Refugees, who literally for the last 75 years from 1949-50 have been the ones who are supposed to give what it sounds like welfare, but they are the second largest employer. They are, by far, the largest education system. And they became also, in that sense, a cover for Hamas’ defence. The Hamas built both sites and capabilities projectiles in different sites inside UNRWA schools, hospitals, and different facilities and then it is being made to appear as if the United Nations is being attacked by Israel, when literally Hamas is just deeply embedded inside that organisation. So, these are four levels of defence that were prepared in advance. The fifth level of defence is the one where Israel has had the biggest challenges. And that’s the information warfare or the terror narrative, or the legitimising of a terror army. And in that one, on October 7, on that day of the attack, while they were attacking, while they were doing their barbaric acts in Israel, taking the hostages, murdering people, killing, sexual abuse, horrific, horrific things. At the same time, Hamas put out two different versions of the October 7 attack, and they filmed two different versions. And those two narratives have had an enormous impact because the one was to terrorize us, the Israelis, supporters of Israel, who saw the barbaric attacks that they did. It’s to make us scared and change our lives and for the rest of the world. It was to show how these resistance fighters are humiliating the horrible occupiers. And that narrative has been expanded horrifically over the last 14 months because of the tiers of defence I described before. Because as soon as they took the hostages and went into these tiers of defence. Hamas immediately presented themselves as the victims, as civilians, as Israel, attacking them for no reason. And, here we are in 2025, with those five tiers of defence still standing, the underground subterranean has not been destroyed by Israel. The facilities or operations of Hamas above ground have been exposed, but again, it’s an enormous amount to take care of. They’re still holding hostages. The international organisations are vehemently anti-Israel, and in the information warfare, a large portion of the world has turned against Israel.

IANS: Right now, there is an exchange of hostages held by Hamas and Palestinian prisoners many of which are terrorists and radical islamists, which is going on, how do you see this panning out? It seems to be too slow, why?

Miri Eisin: Issue of the hostages is a core part of the terror army attack on October 7. Hostages for Hamas are strategic bargaining chips of what they want to achieve. First of all, they want to legitimize themselves. One of the main things that they’ve tried to show over the last 16 months is that the hostages that they took from their homes in such a barbaric attack on October 7 are same as prisoners in Israel. The fact is that those were in Israeli prisons are mainly men that have been, participating actively in terror organisations and terror activities, who were arrested while they were doing these activities, who were put on trial, who were found guilty, who were put into prison, and who are serving prison sentences for terrorism. But Hamas has tried to project as if they are the same as the hostages who were taken and murdered at the age of nine months and 84 years and are held in that subterranean arena. That’s the first thing that they’re trying to achieve. And for Hamas, that means that they don’t mind how long it takes, because, for them, it’s a bargaining chip. What they want to achieve is to get as many prisoners out of jail. That is part of the bargaining chip, but they want it to be in the focus of the world. They want to show it because they want the world to not do the distinction between these hostages that were taken and between the prisoners that are inside Israel. This aspect of the negotiation is very, very difficult. There is no easy way if we don’t let out the prisoners from jail, then we won’t get back our Israeli and non Israeli citizens – mothers, grandparents, children. And, if you let out these horrific terrorists, they have blood on their hands. So, it’s both a combination of, long term prisoners who have been in Israeli jails for acts of terrorism over the last 10, 20, 30, even 40 years and different Hamas terror fighters that were arrested by Israel in the fighting in the last 16 months. That is the horrific world of terrorism. You know that in India, that’s not something unique here. That is part of what terrorism does. They take the hostages and then they want to be paid in prisoners who have been put on trial and found guilty in jail, in the stages of negotiations, Israel tried to get to the hostages in additional way. We managed to release, to free, some of the hostages. Not a large number through military actions, where we went into. We did military actions to bring back the, the dead bodies of some of the hostages. But at the end, what Hamas planned on October 7 was both to take them and to hold them in such a way where if we do our actions, they murdered six young people rather than have us get to them. We inadvertently, so erroneously, killed three hostages, not understanding who they were. They have done all of these actions. That’s part of the terrorizing. So, when we get to the stage of negotiation, this isn’t a happy stage. It’s not a peace stage. There’s no easy way. It isn’t just an exchange. It’s that you have to give up the prisoners. And, Israelis are willing to give up these terror prisoners for the hostages. But, it’s with an understanding that you’re letting go. Somebody who has killed somebody in Israel before or killed many people in Israel before. These prisoners who were let out, some of them, are from West Bank. Some of them are from like East Jerusalem. Some are from Gaza. And part of the negotiation and the devil is in the details is where were will these freed terror prisoners go to? And so that’s why it takes so long. That’s why it’s so hard. We’re letting out horrific terror prisoners, but we’re doing it in exchange for our citizens. And what Hamas want to do is to prolong this, because every time they hold it, there in the eye of the world more. As I said, their defence system is mainly built on the narrative that they are the victims. And if they’re the victims, who’s the bad guy? Israel. So that the whole structure, even of the hostage situation, is about legitimizing for Hamas their own people and about the Hamas and Palestinians being the victims. And, I give all of this background because we’re in a stage where we’ve managed to get out so many of the hostages, we’ve paid a high, high price. We brought in over 175 of the 250 that were taken, but there are still 59 hostages in the Gaza Strip. Of the 59, only 24 are alive, and I don’t even know for sure all of those 24 are alive. But Hamas have held dead hostages for years, not just from this war. And I give all of that because that’s where we are. It’s like you have to negotiate it. You have to agree. It’s never going to be easy. The devil in the detail is also how do you actually do the exchange? And in the five exchanges that happened in January and February, mainly in February of 2025, Hamas used it as a stage. I call this a ‘Terror Theatre’, where they are trying to show all sorts of different aspects that continue with that same horrific terror narrative that I described before. So I’m very, very challenged by the stage we’re in. We’ve agreed to get to a certain stage. They still hold 59 Israelis, 24 of them hopefully still alive. And it’s already been a year and four months. The ones that have come back have been in horrific shape. And Hamas has threatened that they will murder the hostages. They hold them as a bargaining chip. And they announced that they’ll murder, though if we don’t give up what they want. We’re talking about a horrific situation. There’s no easy way out. There’s enormous public pressure inside Israel. And I understand it because it could be your kid. My kid, my mother. I mean, in that example, in that sense, people aren’t aware that there are three bodies of women hostages that were taken and killed. There’s a woman there in her 70s, and you say she’s not alive, but if we don’t get back those bodies, then again, Hamas use these as bargaining chips later on. So right now, what we’re trying to get to is a deal that will bring back all 59, both the 24 who were alive and the rest of the bodies. Hamas is demanding a price which for Israel is very hard to think about at all. It’s not just the release of horrific prisoners, Palestinian terror prisoners from jails. It’s also a really meant that Israel would leave all of the Gaza Strip that we have been in different areas of since the beginning of this war, trying to get to our hostages, trying to destroy Hamas, and to do so when Hamas still has viable capabilities, we’ve degraded them horrifically. And that’s excellent. But we have not destroyed their military capabilities. Certainly we never tried to destroy, the ideology. That’s a really big challenge.

–IANS

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